From ch-lisp at bobobeach.com  Fri Feb 18 21:40:06 2011
From: ch-lisp at bobobeach.com (Cyrus Harmon)
Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2011 13:40:06 -0800
Subject: [clx-devel] trivial-features, CLX and SBCL mutual incompatibility
Message-ID: <EC2D4AAF-308B-42AB-BEBF-D3911809B2BC@bobobeach.com>


Forgive me if you've heard me rant about this before, but there is a mutual incompatibility between CLX, trivial-features (which, for me at least, gets pulled in whenever I try to use CFFI) and SBCL. The problem is that trivial-features puts :little-endian on *features* and CLX has the following code in defdeps.lisp:

#+(or lispm vax little-endian Minima)
(eval-when (eval compile load)
  (pushnew :clx-little-endian *features*))

These old-style eval-when conditions cause SBCL to issue a warning, which causes ASDF to stop compiling CLX. There are many workarounds to this, such as loading CLX before CFFI and there are many possible fixes (such as making SBCL less pedantic or making ASDF not stop on warnings of this kind, etc...) But it seems to me that either fixing the CLX source code such that it is more tolerant of SBCL's pedantry or, alternatively, picking less common names for the *features* in trivial-features would be a good thing. I don't really have a preference, but it would be nice if the CLX and trivial-features maintainers would play nice with each other such that, at least when using SBCL, one can load trivial-features and then CFFI.

I'm certainly open to other suggestions, but I've grown tired of working around this particular problem.

thanks,

Cyrus




From ch-lisp at bobobeach.com  Fri Feb 25 04:36:55 2011
From: ch-lisp at bobobeach.com (Cyrus Harmon)
Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 21:36:55 -0700
Subject: [clx-devel] [cffi-devel] trivial-features,
	CLX and SBCL mutual incompatibility
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikwuhiOH7OoAFLMjArxFPVC51rWvimkRMWOZBaR@mail.gmail.com>
References: <EC2D4AAF-308B-42AB-BEBF-D3911809B2BC@bobobeach.com>
	<AANLkTikwuhiOH7OoAFLMjArxFPVC51rWvimkRMWOZBaR@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <EC20C16F-F947-4AC1-AA77-CA5742C2EAB7@bobobeach.com>


I think the CLX maintainer who objects to modifying CLX to play nice with a lisp implementation that defines :little-endian and doesn't accept old-school eval-when conditions is unlikely to think that this is a step in the right direction.

Cyrus

On Feb 23, 2011, at 10:44 AM, Lu?s Oliveira wrote:

> On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 9:40 PM, Cyrus Harmon <ch-lisp at bobobeach.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Forgive me if you've heard me rant about this before, but there is a mutual incompatibility between CLX, trivial-features (which, for me at least, gets pulled in whenever I try to use CFFI) and SBCL. The problem is that trivial-features puts :little-endian on *features* and CLX has the following code in defdeps.lisp:
>> 
>> #+(or lispm vax little-endian Minima)
>> (eval-when (eval compile load)
>>  (pushnew :clx-little-endian *features*))
> 
> trivial-features is a bit impolite about pushing :little-endian to
> *features*. In my defense, one of the design goals of trivial-features
> is to effortlessly disappear over time. I.e., at some point in the
> future Lisps will have agreed on what keywords to use, and
> trivial-features will be a no-op or removed altogether without changes
> to code that uses it. As such, my decision was to use the same
> keywords that are in widespread use and make minimal adjustments to
> provide consistency across Lisps.
> 
> Perhaps if we can sneak a :little/big-endian feature into SBCL proper,
> the CLX fix will become inevitable and we'll be a tiny bit closer to
> achieving trivial-features' goal? :-)
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> -- 
> Lu?s Oliveira
> http://r42.eu/~luis/




From luismbo at gmail.com  Wed Feb 23 17:59:58 2011
From: luismbo at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lu=EDs_Oliveira?=)
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2011 17:59:58 -0000
Subject: [clx-devel] [cffi-devel] trivial-features,
	CLX and SBCL mutual incompatibility
In-Reply-To: <EC2D4AAF-308B-42AB-BEBF-D3911809B2BC@bobobeach.com>
References: <EC2D4AAF-308B-42AB-BEBF-D3911809B2BC@bobobeach.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikwuhiOH7OoAFLMjArxFPVC51rWvimkRMWOZBaR@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 9:40 PM, Cyrus Harmon <ch-lisp at bobobeach.com> wrote:
>
> Forgive me if you've heard me rant about this before, but there is a mutual incompatibility between CLX, trivial-features (which, for me at least, gets pulled in whenever I try to use CFFI) and SBCL. The problem is that trivial-features puts :little-endian on *features* and CLX has the following code in defdeps.lisp:
>
> #+(or lispm vax little-endian Minima)
> (eval-when (eval compile load)
> ?(pushnew :clx-little-endian *features*))

trivial-features is a bit impolite about pushing :little-endian to
*features*. In my defense, one of the design goals of trivial-features
is to effortlessly disappear over time. I.e., at some point in the
future Lisps will have agreed on what keywords to use, and
trivial-features will be a no-op or removed altogether without changes
to code that uses it. As such, my decision was to use the same
keywords that are in widespread use and make minimal adjustments to
provide consistency across Lisps.

Perhaps if we can sneak a :little/big-endian feature into SBCL proper,
the CLX fix will become inevitable and we'll be a tiny bit closer to
achieving trivial-features' goal? :-)

Cheers,

-- 
Lu?s Oliveira
http://r42.eu/~luis/